peterjanku wrote:To try and equalize competition. If the cars without driver are identical weight, a 130 pound driver enjoys a 100 pound advantage over a 230 pound driver on track.

...as it should be.

H.(right, Clay)B.

ps I weigh 132

Once had my weight down,, to 159,, that was after losing 45lbs+,, it took 14 months in Vietnam!

Hey GSR00 - I also did the VWI diet - went over at 6'3" x 190# (all lean muscle and a 6 pack at that time!) - came back at 140#. My downfall was later after college I went to work as a Drilling Engineer offshore gulf of mexico. No exercise plus an ice cream machine plus steak and potatoes all day and night plus Louisiana gumbo every day plus a metabolism change - ballooned to 240#. Now fight to get under 250#. Haven't seen Jeff Beck chime in yet?

And Hal - your solution could be making the phone book you sit on to see over the steering wheel made out of lead!

claysylvester wrote:....... Haven't seen Jeff Beck chime in yet?

Sure Clay....draw me in....

Obviously I'd go for a higher minimum.

Honestly, from the examples we've already seen coming across the scales, 1580# sounds more reasonable. Whatever the 85th percentile ends up at should be the most fair.

I have gotten a kick out of the discussion about grinding away fiberglass to reduce weight though. Don't the rules specifically forbid this? They used to... maybe they changed.

Whatever it ends up at, it would be nice going forward to make sure that some of the games of the past don't work their way in to the Gen3 cars....Like lead shot in the frame rails, thicker floor pans, etc. for the lighter guys, and thin-wall chrome-moly tubing in the frames, etc. for the heavy guys.

Jeff

Thanks Peter, thought as much just wanted to be sure.

I'm new to SRF, and have a limited data set for weight, but it seems to me there are really two concurrent discussions (debates).

1) What is the weight delta for conversion?
2) What is the target average driver (and bodywork) that is expected to make minimum weight.

I would think the first is easy. Surely the few people who have converted cars took note of before and after. Or SCCA could weigh a few cars, weigh the drivers, estimate (or take the crew's word for) fuel, check for plates, weigh bodywork, etc. I can't think of a reason why the starting point for the weight discussion isn't 1670 minus whatever the delta is (90, 100, 110 pounds?). In any event, this should be purely data driven.

The second is obviously trickier. There is probably a data-driven method to this, but like anything where you stand depends on where you sit!

I'm heavier than I should be (230), but have nearly brand new (no glass work) front and rear sections on the (new to me) car. Two weekends so far (one Major, one regional), starting races with a full tank, no ballast, and rolling across the scales post session at 1680-1700. I should lose 10-20 pounds, and we could probably start with two gallons less fuel (12 pounds?), but if I did both I'd be under weight and need ballast. So to me, the class weight is just about right. I might feel differently after the body gets bunged up a few times. I certainly wouldn't want the minimum weight to shrink by MORE than the engine swap delta.

My position on the list is about January 2016, so I guess I get to sit back and watch the first year's guys hash it out... should be settled law by the time I get into Gen3.

Even simpler than that:
> Reduce minimum by the conversion weight delta.
> Decide if "we" want to reduce weight further to make the car more appealing.

GregCirillo wrote:> Decide if "we" want to reduce weight further to make the car more appealing.

Alternately, one could make the class more appealing/faster without disadvantaging heavier drivers by programming a more aggressive tune for the engine and/or modifying the air intake.

Alternately, one could make the class more appealing/faster without disadvantaging heavier drivers by programming a more aggressive tune for the engine and/or modifying the air intake.

No matter what the horsepower, there will still be a weight differential (and the lighter cars will be faster). As Erik stated, the minimum weight of the car has been 1670# for a long time. Why change what seems to work?

DaveP